View Poll Results: Who Gets Your Support in the CBA Negotiations?

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  • #TeamCFLPA

    13 61.90%
  • CFL - Still need more solid footing

    3 14.29%
  • Undecided

    0 0%
  • Don't care - just get it done!

    5 23.81%
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Thread: CFL CBA Situation

  1. #121
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    Re: CFL CBA Situation


    "No dress rehearsal, this is our life" - Gord Downie

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    Re: CFL CBA Situation

    Argh. As much as we all want what's best for both sides...I really wish this whole mess could just end and we could get back to waiting for football.
    "Here comes the rush...Ray looking endzone, Fred. Stamps. TOUCHDOWN!" - Fred Stamps' TD with 8 seconds left against the Stampeders in 2009

  3. #123
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    Re: CFL CBA Situation

    Quote Originally Posted by Hugoagogo View Post

    There is some irony in the league threatening to not pay report bonuses, while having prohibited the payment of other bonuses through the off-season.

    Likewise, what's the difference if the player is "on strike" or "suspended" during training camp? Not like they're paid for that anyways. Kind of reminds me of the "you can't quit, you're fired" approach.

    Despite the escalated rhetoric - and kudos to the CFL for not being public about it, though it's obvious that someone would have leaked the memo from among all the players that received it - it sounds like there was positive and productive tone in the sessions over the past few days. In addition to three days scheduled for next week, there are apparently four days blocked off for the following week, the last of which is May 15... just a few days before camp. Andrew Brandt is a good Twitter follow for insight into the business side of the NFL (former Packers VP) and has two sort of catchphrases - "Deadlines cause action", and, "There will be lawyers". As frustrating as the lost time was, as frustrating as the delayed start of negotiations was, the reality is that we'd likely be right where we are now either way, and it's only going to be the deadline, and the looming reality of the deadline for both sides, that will test resolve and hopefully cause the movement required to get a fair deal done.

    I am definitely fully on #TeamCFLPA, but I'm not looking for them to get a deal that hurts the league and it's sustainability. I want them to get a fair deal - one that gives a fair raise in compensation and addresses the minimum salaries, one that provides some long-term coverage for rehab of football injuries that go beyond a year, and one that gives the CFLPA a proper voice at the table for things like rules committee and player safety.

    Nervous, but cautiously optimistic.

  4. #124
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    Re: CFL CBA Situation

    Irony, or hypocrisy?

  5. #125
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    Re: CFL CBA Situation

    It's like they are playing chicken with cars that have no steering wheels.
    "Of all the so-called virtues, the most over-rated is faith" - Christopher Hitchens

  6. #126
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    Re: CFL CBA Situation

    Quote Originally Posted by Deathsdoorstep View Post
    It's like they are playing chicken with cars that have no steering wheels.
    I sure hope there's at least an e-brake!
    "Here comes the rush...Ray looking endzone, Fred. Stamps. TOUCHDOWN!" - Fred Stamps' TD with 8 seconds left against the Stampeders in 2009

  7. #127
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    Re: CFL CBA Situation

    I don't like this at all. If I were a player I want to be treated with respect and this in my opinion is a disrespectful tactic on the part of CFL GM's.
    Run the Ball up the gut around the horn it does not matter. We run we win what is so difficult to understand.

  8. #128
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    Re: CFL CBA Situation


    "No dress rehearsal, this is our life" - Gord Downie

  9. #129
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    Re: CFL CBA Situation

    So, in other words...

    ...impasse.
    "Here comes the rush...Ray looking endzone, Fred. Stamps. TOUCHDOWN!" - Fred Stamps' TD with 8 seconds left against the Stampeders in 2009

  10. #130

    Re: CFL CBA Situation

    I still think this thing gets done before camp, even if it is the night before.

  11. #131
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    Re: CFL CBA Situation

    Quote Originally Posted by ben_the_eskimo View Post
    I still think this thing gets done before camp, even if it is the night before.
    It was never going to get done a month in advance, no matter how early they started. And it likely wasn't going to get done a week in advance either. Today's news isn't heartening, but like you, I have some optimism that there is enough at stake that both sides will be working hard over the next few weeks to bridge the gaps and get something done.

  12. #132
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    Re: CFL CBA Situation

    Quote Originally Posted by GreatWhiteNorth View Post
    It was never going to get done a month in advance, no matter how early they started. And it likely wasn't going to get done a week in advance either. Today's news isn't heartening, but like you, I have some optimism that there is enough at stake that both sides will be working hard over the next few weeks to bridge the gaps and get something done.
    It's a big game of chicken with both sides trying to wait out the other.
    Edmonton Eskimos, 2015 grey cup CHAMPS!!!!!

  13. #133
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    Re: CFL CBA Situation


    "No dress rehearsal, this is our life" - Gord Downie

  14. #134
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    Re: CFL CBA Situation

    Quote Originally Posted by Hugoagogo View Post

    This may work into the players hands as the league cannot afford to let some teams have their players report and others not. Will give an unfair advantage to those teams.
    Edmonton Eskimos, 2015 grey cup CHAMPS!!!!!

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    Re: CFL CBA Situation

    Quote Originally Posted by Looner View Post
    This may work into the players hands as the league cannot afford to let some teams have their players report and others not. Will give an unfair advantage to those teams.
    I think you're correct.

    If it was a situation where all teams were in a situation where players were not reporting, it would likely ramp up a little pressure to get things done so as to not disrupt the season. When it's a situation where there would seemingly be different situations for different teams, that could be equally disruptive for the season, but adding in the element of disruption to the competitive balance. By mid-season, it would all even out, but for the early part of the season, even 3-4 days of additional time for installing the playbook can have a real impact.

    One of the interesting elements is going to be keeping unity intact while seeing different situations for different players. For a player in a province where they're encouraged to not report from the start, they're at home, where presumably they've got a lease, people, etc. For those that have to come up and report, go through a few days of camp, and then walk out, they're now in a different city, presumably no longer eligible to stay in the team-provided hotel accommodations or partake in the catered team meals, and have no more per diem coming. That could create some difficulty for players that don't have financial stability, and may cause the CFLPA to have to step up in support roles to backstop guys or provide strike pay of some sort.

    Hopefully, it doesn't come to this, but it's interesting to look at the twists and turns.

  16. #136
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    Re: CFL CBA Situation

    Here's the latest Esks twist on the situation:

    Eskimos players will report to training camp on time, but strike looming

    With the current agreement set to expire on May 18, the same day veteran medicals are scheduled, with training camp opening the following day, all players outside of Alberta and Ontario have been told not to report.

    But due to labour laws in those provinces, the Eskimos are among a group that can’t legally strike until May 23, players association executive director Brian Ramsay told media during a conference call Thursday, following three days of talks in Toronto.
    "Here comes the rush...Ray looking endzone, Fred. Stamps. TOUCHDOWN!" - Fred Stamps' TD with 8 seconds left against the Stampeders in 2009

  17. #137
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    Re: CFL CBA Situation





    Mr. Irving brings up a very good point. As always, this league is still a fragile one when it comes to finances. New ownership is the only thing that saved the Argos from the annual "what if there was not a team in Toronto" discussion; Montreal ownership situation is also looking scary.

    Ticket revenues are not going to go up (dramatically), so unless there are plans for other sources such as additional TV contracts or monies from streaming CFL catalogue (itunes/Google), baby steps must be taken. I want to see the players get better rewarded financially, and I do want to see their benefits expand on things like medical, but it all isn't going to happen in this contract.

    I wonder if the players (and perhaps the league) are better off going with a shorter CBA (say two years) and allow time for the "partnership" to really evaluate where monies will come from to pay the future bills?
    Last edited by Hugoagogo; 05-12-2019 at 01:25 PM.
    "No dress rehearsal, this is our life" - Gord Downie

  18. #138
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    Re: CFL CBA Situation

    ^ That's why I think it's smart Ambroise is looking at getting other countries on board to watching the CFL. There was apparently a TV deal with a station in Mexico to show games but not much has been said since then.

    It's interesting too with the tweet above because it was said earlier this off-season that the CFL has a revenue of $200+ million a year. Was that just a rumor thrown out by the players or was that actually proven? It's hard to know who is telling the truth because the CFL has been such a "private" league in terms of finances for years.

    I hope this ends well and the season isn't delayed. This is a league that cannot afford a delay in the season starting.

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    Re: CFL CBA Situation

    Quote Originally Posted by Hugoagogo View Post




    Mr. Irving brings up a very good point. As always, this league is still a fragile one when it comes to finances. New ownership is the only thing that saved the Argos from the annual "what if there was not a team in Toronto" discussion; Montreal ownership situation is also looking scary.

    Ticket revenues are not going to go up (dramatically), so unless there are plans for other sources such as additional TV contracts or monies from streaming CFL catalogue (itunes/Google), baby steps must be taken. I want to see the players get better rewarded financially, and I do want to see their benefits expand on things like medical, but it all isn't going to happen in this contract.

    I wonder if the players (and perhaps the league) are better off going with a shorter CBA (say two years) and allow time for the "partnership" to really evaluate where monies will come from to pay the future bills?
    I have a lot of respect for Knuckles Irving, and I think his point is valid - no one wins if the new deal makes the league (or its teams) unsustainable. This is not a league that could support a situation where 44% of revenues go to salaries, but then, that is not what the CFLPA is looking for either.

    It was erroneously reported/speculated a few months back that the CFL paid our around 22% of revenues in salary, but even in that report it was obvious that the methodology was flawed, as it was using the salary cap as the measure, when it is clear that there are many salaries that don't count against the cap for injured players. If the average club loses the equivalent of 90 man-games to the 6-game IR (5 players per game on average), then that's an additional $500,000 or so (approximately 9% of salary cap) spent on salary.

    I don't know the number that the CFLPA is looking for in terms of a boost in the salary cap, but I'm guessing that the ask is more in the 10% range, with smaller, incremental steps of 1% per year over the course of the deal.

    This is the CANADIAN Football League, and salaries get paid in CAD - as it should be. It should, however, be recognized that over half of the employees are from the USA, and at the time the last CBA was signed, the USDCAD exchange rate was between 1.05/1.10 (around a 93.5 cent CAD). It is currently trading around 1.35 (74 cent CAD). This is not just about American players - this is, as I state, a CANADIAN league - but if one is to consider inflation in terms of whether employees are keeping up with the rise of prices, it becomes relevant that about half of CFL players, at the end of the day, are making significantly less than they were 5 years ago, and even an equally distributed 10% rise in the cap will not get them back to how well they were doing then.

    A shorter-term deal may be viable if they can't get on the same page for a longer term one, but obviously no one wants to have this disruption again in a few years. The CFLPA would want assurances that they CFL would not, again, hold/prohibit off-season bonus payments, and the CFL would want assurances that this wasn't just two years of saving up by the CFLPA to be able to withstand a prolonged strike.

    Hopefully, there is enough common ground and goodwill that they find a reasonable compromise on compensation, a reasonable distribution for voices in decision making (rules/player safety/etc) and either a stop-gap contingency or a road towards better longer-term health coverage where needed. With the latter, I'm guessing that the CFLPA will have to accept specifically omitting "concussions" from coverage or cap the costs associated, as I believe that remains the great unknown/risk for the league. It's ridiculous to deny that there's a link, but I do believe there is still great uncertainty/unknown aspects as to longer-term treatment costs and a goal to limit past, present and future liability to the league.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jtuck09 View Post
    ^ That's why I think it's smart Ambroise is looking at getting other countries on board to watching the CFL. There was apparently a TV deal with a station in Mexico to show games but not much has been said since then.

    It's interesting too with the tweet above because it was said earlier this off-season that the CFL has a revenue of $200+ million a year. Was that just a rumor thrown out by the players or was that actually proven? It's hard to know who is telling the truth because the CFL has been such a "private" league in terms of finances for years.

    I hope this ends well and the season isn't delayed. This is a league that cannot afford a delay in the season starting.
    The Bombers' Financial Statements showed a CFL Distributions line item of $4.35 million for 2018. Extrapolated over 9 teams, that would suggest that the CFL had a profit of $39.15 million to distribute after covering their league costs. I don't know if they retain anything as a buffer/stability fund.

    If they actually do have revenues of $200 million, that suggests that they're generating actual profits of around 20% of revenues.

    That is not to say that there are not individual teams losing money - I think it's apparent that there are. With Edmonton and Winnipeg both showing healthy profits, they would have been in loss positions if it were not for the CFL distributions, so it's easy to imagine that other teams are not at that level and some are likely under water.

  20. #140
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    Re: CFL CBA Situation

    The schedule could start going out of whack immediately. The first preseason game which involves Edmonton goes May 24th, the day after the Esks could legally go on strike. Unfortunately it's against BC who could legally not show up for camp. If the Lions lose even 3 or 4 days that game likely has to be bumped.

    My gut feel is that if the 4 teams who could legally go on strike do so on the 18th then the CFL will lock the other 5 out.

  21. #141
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    Re: CFL CBA Situation

    Revenue streams can be all over the map team to team. Some have real sweetheart lease arrangements. Some for all intents are contracted to manage the facility or have total control of concessions including the profits. Others at best get a small piece of the concession action. Some may get nothing. Some can realize revenues from parking. Others don't.

  22. #142
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    Re: CFL CBA Situation

    Some positive news. CFLPA advises players to prepare to report to TC...https://3downnation.com/2019/05/14/c...raining-camps/
    Last edited by adb; 05-14-2019 at 01:22 PM.
    ôRUN THE DANG BALL!" -Leigh Anne Tuohy character from the film The Blind Side

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  23. #143
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    Re: CFL CBA Situation

    Get 'er done, guys.

    "Here comes the rush...Ray looking endzone, Fred. Stamps. TOUCHDOWN!" - Fred Stamps' TD with 8 seconds left against the Stampeders in 2009

  24. #144
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    Re: CFL CBA Situation

    Last edited by GREYx14; 05-15-2019 at 07:03 AM.

  25. #145
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    Re: CFL CBA Situation

    Whew!!! Sounds like it’s a go!

  26. #146
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    Re: CFL CBA Situation

    Quote Originally Posted by GREYx14 View Post
    nice Bday present for you
    Edmonton Eskimos, 2015 grey cup CHAMPS!!!!!

  27. #147

    Re: CFL CBA Situation

    I was never worried.

  28. #148
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    Re: CFL CBA Situation

    Very happy, lets get the show on the road!

  29. #149
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    Re: CFL CBA Situation

    Let’s go!!

  30. #150
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    Re: CFL CBA Situation

    Still has to be voted on by BOG and ratified by the players. Expectations are the BOG will pass it. Ratification by players might be closer than one thinks based on some initial responses. Should get a clearer picture later today after the CFLPA Executive presents the terms to the team reps. They will then pass the info on to the rest of the players.

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