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Thread: Around the CFL - 2020

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    Re: Around the CFL - 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by bone View Post
    Hopefully. The shortened season always seemed like a pipe dream with the limited resources the CFL has. Just think of the costs for testing alone! Let alone making it worthwhile for the players with such small salaries.
    Yup. Hopefully the feds make the cash contingent on the owners starting to care about the CFL as much as the fans do.

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    Re: Around the CFL - 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by tigerdar View Post
    Should have changed their name to Bombardier or Air Canada then the money would have started flowing.
    Or CBC?
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    Re: Around the CFL - 2020

    Season is officially cancelled...


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    Re: Around the CFL - 2020

    Something that I thought was going to happen. I would like the league to take this time to figure out how to change how they operate. Even without Covid, in a normal year I think at least half of the teams usually lose money every year. That isn't sustainable. Something has to change.
    Blindly accept whatever they do and if it doesn't work out, I guess there's always next year.

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    Re: Around the CFL - 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Sectionq View Post
    Something that I thought was going to happen. I would like the league to take this time to figure out how to change how they operate. Even without Covid, in a normal year I think at least half of the teams usually lose money every year. That isn't sustainable. Something has to change.
    Yes. Yes, it does. And if I'm the guy at the federal government making the decision on whther to give them a grant or a loan, I'm making it contibgent on a change in how they do things.

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    Re: Around the CFL - 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Deathsdoorstep View Post
    I think the feds will give them money, just not for a shortened season that may not get finished. They'll give them money to stay afloat.
    I'm ok with that too but let's be honest the CFL business model is outdated and antiquated and they need to get their heads out of their asses.
    In Rod we trust

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    Re: Around the CFL - 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Deathsdoorstep View Post
    Yes. Yes, it does. And if I'm the guy at the federal government making the decision on whther to give them a grant or a loan, I'm making it contibgent on a change in how they do things.
    Totally agree. I'd want to know how they plan on making it better if I was the Feds because what they are doing clearly isn't working and it hasn't just been this year. The league can't blame the economy because even when the entire economy was going, there were teams in the CFL not making money.

    I would want to know why fans aren't coming? I have said it before, in a City like Toronto or Vancouver, with that many people why can't you get consistently 20-25,000 fans? Quit blaming TV or winning/losing. For the most part, it's unrealistic for a team to win every single year. There will be dips. But with big of a population, it should be easy to get that many people if the product is good. The Argos have had years where they were good and their attendance still sucked, same with the Lions. WHY? Even in Calgary that have been good for a long time, attendance is dropping. WHY and it isn't just the economy.

    IMO, if people are entertained, feel like they are getting good value for their money even if the team doesn't win all the time, they will still go because they enjoy it. As you all know, my family after 25 yrs cancelled our season tickets before the start of last season. It wasn't an easy decision, we went back and forth. Part of it was the travel. Coming from Red Deer, it was a big commitment for us to make a game vs someone that lives in the City but for 20+ yrs we happily did it. Why, because we enjoyed it. The team wasn't always winning, there were some crap years but we enjoyed it and we planned our lives around it. We made pretty much every single game regardless of the weather. But in the last few years before we cancelled, we didn't enjoy it as much. The atmosphere wasn't the same, it wasn't as much fun. It had gotten to a point where we didn't plan our lives around the games like we used too, we fit the games in when we could. If we missed for a variety of reasons, some legit some just because we didn't feel like going or the weather wasn't ideal, oh well. So when we got to that point, we knew it was time to get rid of them.

    So if I am the CFL I am figuring out why happened that made it so people don't want to come anymore. How do you make it so being in the stadium is a must place to be? There are a grand total of 9 home games spread over 5-6 months. It's not like it's an every other day thing like the NHL can be. We are talking once or twice a month for people. So if it's a must place to go, people can find time for once or twice a month. I have really, really nice TV's and a great set up to watch games and trust me, being able to watch the games on my big, High Def TV had nothing to do with my reason for not going.
    Blindly accept whatever they do and if it doesn't work out, I guess there's always next year.

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    Re: Around the CFL - 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Sectionq View Post
    Totally agree. I'd want to know how they plan on making it better if I was the Feds because what they are doing clearly isn't working and it hasn't just been this year. The league can't blame the economy because even when the entire economy was going, there were teams in the CFL not making money.

    I would want to know why fans aren't coming? I have said it before, in a City like Toronto or Vancouver, with that many people why can't you get consistently 20-25,000 fans? Quit blaming TV or winning/losing. For the most part, it's unrealistic for a team to win every single year. There will be dips. But with big of a population, it should be easy to get that many people if the product is good. The Argos have had years where they were good and their attendance still sucked, same with the Lions. WHY? Even in Calgary that have been good for a long time, attendance is dropping. WHY and it isn't just the economy.
    .
    Must be Braley's fault...
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    Re: Around the CFL - 2020

    There is a lot of the 'CFL must change their business model' but nothing suggesting what to do. I'm not sure there is anything they can do to fix the situation. I guess you could look at MLS and figure out how they get fans to the games.

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    Re: Around the CFL - 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by boydo View Post
    Must be Braley's fault...
    He was definitely one of the guys that slowed up the process. Look how long it's taking him to sell the Lions. Every year, it's a different excuse. I think he's still riding on that Arland Bruce lawsuit excuse.
    Hope, at the end of the day connects us all, no matter how different we are

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    Re: Around the CFL - 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Deathsdoorstep View Post
    Yup. The league surviving is what's important. And if they now have a year then maybe they should look at a better business model....and a better commissioner.
    Quote Originally Posted by tigerdar View Post
    I'm ok with that too but let's be honest the CFL business model is outdated and antiquated and they need to get their heads out of their asses.
    1. I’m so relieved the season is cancelled from a pure safety perspective. The CFL doesn’t have the same money as the NHL and the measures they were putting forward weren’t as tight, even based on what made it into the public sphere. Exhaling.

    2. The revised business model should include making more of an effort to attract the trifecta - younger, female, multicultural. Making the CFL cool to even 1 of these groups will go a long way to ensure some sort of sustainability. 2020 especially - with pandemic plans & changing team names & BLM/related discussions - has proven how outdated they are & who the primary demographic is fan-wise which is none of the above 3 that’s for sure. (Sorry in advance if any of you fit the bill & take my comments personally.)

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    Re: Around the CFL - 2020

    Let's say they got their loan and started gearing up for the season. What do they have time for now? Two months of games (7-8)? Is it worth it?

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    Re: Around the CFL - 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Uncle Bobby View Post
    Let's say they got their loan and started gearing up for the season. What do they have time for now? Two months of games (7-8)? Is it worth it?
    They don't have time. If the announced today it was happening to get going they would need:

    - Every player for every team would have to be found, quarantined for 2 weeks, tested, then come up. It's August 17. To get all that done with the 2 week quarantine, that puts you into after Labour day and you haven't even had a single practice yet.
    - You need a training camp. These guys haven't played a down of football since November, you need a camp.

    So best base scenario if everything goes perfect, you aren't playing a game until the end of September.

    I would think that to make the season at least somewhat fair, you should play at least each team once. So 8 games. These guys can't play more than 1 game a week, too hard on the body. So the season would take 2 months. So that puts you at the end of November when the season ends. Then you have playoffs. So you would be finishing right before Christmas.

    You can't be playing football in Winnipeg who was the hub City in December. No chance.
    Blindly accept whatever they do and if it doesn't work out, I guess there's always next year.

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    Re: Around the CFL - 2020

    I believe the last proposal was for a 6-game season, with an eight team playoff taking 3 weeks and ending in November.
    Hope, at the end of the day connects us all, no matter how different we are

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    Re: Around the CFL - 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Hugoagogo View Post
    I believe the last proposal was for a 6-game season, with an eight team playoff taking 3 weeks and ending in November.
    Well even if that was what happened, you aren't ending at the end of November when it's Aug 17.
    Blindly accept whatever they do and if it doesn't work out, I guess there's always next year.

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    Re: Around the CFL - 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Sectionq View Post
    They don't have time. If the announced today it was happening to get going they would need:

    - Every player for every team would have to be found, quarantined for 2 weeks, tested, then come up. It's August 17. To get all that done with the 2 week quarantine, that puts you into after Labour day and you haven't even had a single practice yet.
    - You need a training camp. These guys haven't played a down of football since November, you need a camp.

    So best base scenario if everything goes perfect, you aren't playing a game until the end of September.

    I would think that to make the season at least somewhat fair, you should play at least each team once. So 8 games. These guys can't play more than 1 game a week, too hard on the body. So the season would take 2 months. So that puts you at the end of November when the season ends. Then you have playoffs. So you would be finishing right before Christmas.

    You can't be playing football in Winnipeg who was the hub City in December. No chance.
    ....and if the plan is to save money by having players quarantine in US before they come up, what’s the point? Getting on a plane negates it. The quarantine period should be upon arrival in Canada.

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    Re: Around the CFL - 2020

    Hope, at the end of the day connects us all, no matter how different we are

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    Re: Around the CFL - 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Hugoagogo View Post
    Maybe if he came back the league could find a way out of this.

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    Re: Around the CFL - 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by bone View Post
    Maybe if he came back the league could find a way out of this.
    Agreed. Ambrosie is a joke. He needs to step down and turn it over to someone who has a vision for the future.
    ----------------------
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    Re: Around the CFL - 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by The Messiah View Post
    Agreed. Ambrosie is a joke. He needs to step down and turn it over to someone who has a vision for the future.
    He might be but does he actually have the power to do anything?
    Blindly accept whatever they do and if it doesn't work out, I guess there's always next year.

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    Re: Around the CFL - 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Sectionq View Post
    He might be but does he actually have the power to do anything?
    That I don't know. But the CFL global initiative seems like a waste of money. Why focus on trying to get CFL interest and grow the game in Mexico for example. Focus on the local markets.

    Market your star players. Grow your social media platform. Provide weekly player interviews, games, sports challenges, interactive stuff with fans to show players personalities and grow connections to the fans.
    The in stadium experience needs to be better also but that's a whole other thread.
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    Re: Around the CFL - 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by The Messiah View Post
    That I don't know. But the CFL global initiative seems like a waste of money. Why focus on trying to get CFL interest and grow the game in Mexico for example. Focus on the local markets.

    Market your star players. Grow your social media platform. Provide weekly player interviews, games, sports challenges, interactive stuff with fans to show players personalities and grow connections to the fans.
    The in stadium experience needs to be better also but that's a whole other thread.
    There’s actually been a lot of that over the past few years on twitter/IG/Facebook/snapchat. Brodie made a career out of it.

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    Re: Around the CFL - 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by The Messiah View Post
    That I don't know. But the CFL global initiative seems like a waste of money. Why focus on trying to get CFL interest and grow the game in Mexico for example. Focus on the local markets.

    Market your star players. Grow your social media platform. Provide weekly player interviews, games, sports challenges, interactive stuff with fans to show players personalities and grow connections to the fans.
    The in stadium experience needs to be better also but that's a whole other thread.
    To do what you are suggesting would require the CFL to do things differently. The CFL BOG doesn't strike me as the type that likes to change. The whole Global initiative seems like a plan to hopefully squeeze money out of other places that don't have any idea what the CFL is all about so they don't have to change. Go to a country that knows little to nothing about you so when you show up, you are brand new and maybe you get lucky. So all the old crap that doesn't work here anymore, those other countries don't know about.

    To make changes to grow in Canada would actually take some time, effort and creative thinking something that it seems the CFL isn't interested in doing. Shove the same product down our throats that we have seen for decades then point the finger at high def tv as the reason less people come to games anymore rather than admit that maybe your product isn't that great and people are sick of paying to go watch it.

    As an example, how many times has it been brought up about moving up the schedule? We live in a country that more times than not the weather sucks in November. Yet the playoffs, the showcase of the league is being played when the weather usually SUCKS. Sometimes the weather at the end of November is Ok but other times its miserable. If you are trying to showcase your game, why the hell would you want your championship game being played when it's -20 below, snow falling, guys can barely run. While not perfect, the weather in May is typically a hell of a lot better than November. So if you move the season up into May, you are finishing in October when the weather is usually pretty good. The fan base is aging so you need to bring in new, young fans. I became a fan of the CFL as a kid. I can tell you as a parent, I do not want to go to a football game with a 9 and 7 yr old in November when it's -15 out. Sitting outside for 4 hours in the cold is not fun. I don't care how tough you are, you get cold. There is nothing better than being at the football field on a hot sunny day with a cold beer. By moving your season up, it's a simple change that maximized the Canadian weather. You would have pretty much your entire season in the best weather we get every year. But they won't do it. WHY!! By moving it up, you would probably eliminate the odd guy who goes down to the NFL, gets cut and comes up for the last 1/4 of the season. AND???? As a fan of the CFL, I would much rather have more games in the best weather we get vs losing out on bring up 1 NFL cut. Rather than change to make it more appealing to the casual person because I can bet that a casual person is not going to go to a game when the weather sucks or is cold, they tell us how this is how it's been since forever, it's the "Canadian way" and we Canadians are "Tough". Being tough has nothing to do with it. I would take sitting in the seats on a sunny day, in my t-shirt and shorts, cold beer in my hand, kids eating an ice cream vs huddled under a blanket with our ski pants on while the kids bitch their feet are cold asking me when they can go because they are cold. I am sure I am not alone in that thinking.

    Just one example of a blatantly obvious change that the CFL refuses to do.
    Last edited by Sectionq; 08-18-2020 at 04:48 PM.
    Blindly accept whatever they do and if it doesn't work out, I guess there's always next year.

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    Re: Around the CFL - 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Sectionq View Post
    To do what you are suggesting would require the CFL to do things differently. The CFL BOG doesn't strike me as the type that likes to change. The whole Global initiative seems like a plan to hopefully squeeze money out of other places that don't have any idea what the CFL is all about so they don't have to change. Go to a country that knows little to nothing about you so when you show up, you are brand new and maybe you get lucky. So all the old crap that doesn't work here anymore, those other countries don't know about.

    To make changes to grow in Canada would actually take some time, effort and creative thinking something that it seems the CFL isn't interested in doing. Shove the same product down our throats that we have seen for decades then point the finger at high def tv as the reason less people come to games anymore rather than admit that maybe your product isn't that great and people are sick of paying to go watch it.

    As an example, how many times has it been brought up about moving up the schedule? We live in a country that more times than not the weather sucks in November. Yet the playoffs, the showcase of the league is being played when the weather usually SUCKS. Sometimes the weather at the end of November is Ok but other times its miserable. If you are trying to showcase your game, why the hell would you want your championship game being played when it's -20 below, snow falling, guys can barely run. While not perfect, the weather in May is typically a hell of a lot better than November. So if you move the season up into May, you are finishing in October when the weather is usually pretty good. The fan base is aging so you need to bring in new, young fans. I became a fan of the CFL as a kid. I can tell you as a parent, I do not want to go to a football game with a 9 and 7 yr old in November when it's -15 out. Sitting outside for 4 hours in the cold is not fun. I don't care how tough you are, you get cold. There is nothing better than being at the football field on a hot sunny day with a cold beer. By moving your season up, it's a simple change that maximized the Canadian weather. You would have pretty much your entire season in the best weather we get every year. But they won't do it. WHY!! By moving it up, you would probably eliminate the odd guy who goes down to the NFL, gets cut and comes up for the last 1/4 of the season. AND???? As a fan of the CFL, I would much rather have more games in the best weather we get vs losing out on bring up 1 NFL cut. Rather than change to make it more appealing to the casual person because I can bet that a casual person is not going to go to a game when the weather sucks or is cold, they tell us how this is how it's been since forever, it's the "Canadian way" and we Canadians are "Tough". Being tough has nothing to do with it. I would take sitting in the seats on a sunny day, in my t-shirt and shorts, cold beer in my hand, kids eating an ice cream vs huddled under a blanket with our ski pants on while the kids bitch their feet are cold asking me when they can go because they are cold. I am sure I am not alone in that thinking.

    Just one example of a blatantly obvious change that the CFL refuses to do.
    Ambrosie has stated several times that he is in favour of moving the season forward a month and having the Grey Cup in early November, if not late October. I have a feeling that TSN isn't a fan of having their broadcasts go up against the Stanley Cup finals in Canada on a competing station, so that might be where the push-back is from.
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    Re: Around the CFL - 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by 56Parkies View Post
    Ambrosie has stated several times that he is in favour of moving the season forward a month and having the Grey Cup in early November, if not late October. I have a feeling that TSN isn't a fan of having their broadcasts go up against the Stanley Cup finals in Canada on a competing station, so that might be where the push-back is from.
    So schedule your games around them. The CFL plays games, Thursdays, Fridays and usually Saturdays. Some Sundays. Hockey games are usually at night. I get that the CFL wouldn't want to go up against a Canadian team in the playoffs. You don't see a lot of hockey games in the middle of the afternoon and if their is, it's usually 2 American teams. I honestly doubt that most Canadians will sit down at 1:30 in the afternoon in May on a Saturday to watch 2 southern American NHL teams go at it.

    If TSN is the reason which I have my doubts they are but if they are, I'd be telling the league what's better NO CFL at all or you being flexible. Like I said, as a father of 2 younger boys, kids the CFL WANTS to fall in love with their league, sitting in the freezing cold to watch a game is not going to happen for us. I don't like freezing my ass off for 4 hours, either do my kids or wife. Something has to change. I can tell you that in May with no hockey rights, there isn't a hell of a lot to watch on TSN.
    Blindly accept whatever they do and if it doesn't work out, I guess there's always next year.

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    Re: Around the CFL - 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by 56Parkies View Post
    Ambrosie has stated several times that he is in favour of moving the season forward a month and having the Grey Cup in early November, if not late October. I have a feeling that TSN isn't a fan of having their broadcasts go up against the Stanley Cup finals in Canada on a competing station, so that might be where the push-back is from.
    Fine then, get rid of two games, go back to a 16 game schedule, remove one bye week and we're only starting a week earlier than the plan was for this year. Or if we allow for the Grey Cup game to be the first Sunday in November, it's not a change to start time at all.

    Yes, that could reduce revenue (theoretically), but each game is much more marketable to sell now. Also would require some tweaking to player contracts, but let's face it, that's happening anyways now so use the opportunity to build the best CFL format possible.

    Q also brings a good point. By the time the CFL would start the NHL is typically into the Conference Finals with all games starting at 6PM Mountain. They could easily go with a Friday prime time, Saturday 11 and 2, and Sunday 2 start time and they avoid most of that competition. Or heaven forbid, use those extra TSN channels and have two games that overlap.

    I also think there is a good opportunity for the league to market a Father's Day triple header based of secondary rivalries early in the season to build hype for summer ball. You think an EE vs. Riders game in Edmonton on Father's Day wouldn't be a good idea to get those franchises pumped up about their seasons?

    Scheduling is another issue. The CFL loves cramming all the crappy games into the first three or four weeks of the season. Why not push some of those rivalry games earlier in the year to push greater emphasis on a strong start and build hype. As it is right now, by the first week of August, all of the Eastern teams are typically average a 2-4 record and all the Western team 4-2 record because of the emphasis early on cross division gqmes. Get some of those rivalry games early and that may tighten it up league wide.
    Last edited by bone; 08-19-2020 at 08:22 AM.

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    Re: Around the CFL - 2020

    Hope, at the end of the day connects us all, no matter how different we are

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    Re: Around the CFL - 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by bone View Post
    Fine then, get rid of two games, go back to a 16 game schedule, remove one bye week and we're only starting a week earlier than the plan was for this year. Or if we allow for the Grey Cup game to be the first Sunday in November, it's not a change to start time at all.

    Yes, that could reduce revenue (theoretically), but each game is much more marketable to sell now. Also would require some tweaking to player contracts, but let's face it, that's happening anyways now so use the opportunity to build the best CFL format possible.

    Q also brings a good point. By the time the CFL would start the NHL is typically into the Conference Finals with all games starting at 6PM Mountain. They could easily go with a Friday prime time, Saturday 11 and 2, and Sunday 2 start time and they avoid most of that competition. Or heaven forbid, use those extra TSN channels and have two games that overlap.

    I also think there is a good opportunity for the league to market a Father's Day triple header based of secondary rivalries early in the season to build hype for summer ball. You think an EE vs. Riders game in Edmonton on Father's Day wouldn't be a good idea to get those franchises pumped up about their seasons?

    Scheduling is another issue. The CFL loves cramming all the crappy games into the first three or four weeks of the season. Why not push some of those rivalry games earlier in the year to push greater emphasis on a strong start and build hype. As it is right now, by the first week of August, all of the Eastern teams are typically average a 2-4 record and all the Western team 4-2 record because of the emphasis early on cross division gqmes. Get some of those rivalry games early and that may tighten it up league wide.
    Personally I think the season could be moved up a few weeks at least. The idea of a Father's Day game is awesome to me but we don't want to get in trouble with all the "Non-Fathers" who would get their knickers in a twist because of lack of inclusion etc. (I'm only being partly sarcastic there...which is sad but that's not the point.)
    Once an Eskimo, ALWAYS an Eskimo.

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    Re: Around the CFL - 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by boydo View Post
    Personally I think the season could be moved up a few weeks at least. The idea of a Father's Day game is awesome to me but we don't want to get in trouble with all the "Non-Fathers" who would get their knickers in a twist because of lack of inclusion etc. (I'm only being partly sarcastic there...which is sad but that's not the point.)
    Unfortunately, I see your point. If we moved the schedule up early enough for Mother's Day, I'd gladly have a Mother's Day game as well, but I can't see a league game being played as early as May 8th.

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    Re: Around the CFL - 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by The Messiah View Post
    Agreed. Ambrosie is a joke. He needs to step down and turn it over to someone who has a vision for the future.
    It's easy to use perfect 20/20 hindsight to dump on Ambrosie for how he's handled a crisis the likes of which no other CFL Commissioner, or any other league Commish for that matter, has ever had to face before. There is also zero guarantee Cohon would have handled it any better. We'll just never know the answer to that.

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